Tami Winkelman: Fighting Thru Prayer, episode 124

0:00 If you have a prodigal, you can discover help and hope for your wilderness journey right here at when you love a prodigal. And also help and hope for your own life journey. My guest today is Tami Winkleman, who helps all of us fight for our prodigals. Tami, welcome. Thank you. Good morning. It's nice to be here. Good morning. It's going to be great. Let me tell them a little about you. Tami and I first met, though we still haven't met face to face, because we both have a ministry named Prayer for Prodigals. We have loved getting to know each other and to see that we have the same heart for prodigals and those who love them.

0:48 And we both know who it is who will seek out, pursue, rescue, and restore our wanderers. Here's a little background about this amazing woman. She is the founder and leader of Prayer for Prodigals, which has a worldwide following. She leads an online prayer time most weeks on Facebook or pretty much every week. And she is the author of Fighting for Your Prodigal Through Prayer and also another book, Encouragement in the Waiting. Her third book, which is coming out soon, is called Trust God as I really love this.

1:29 It's about his names and attributes for your journey with a prodigal. And when will that be out? You know, we don't have a final date. I'm waiting on some variables. But not too long. Yeah, maybe a month. Wow. That's quick then. She is passionate about encouraging and helping people who love a prodigal to pray and rest in God's promises until their prodigals come back to God. She and Kevin, her husband of 41 years, make their home in Alabama. And my daughter is not too far away. Next time I'm there, I'll come see you.

2:13 And they have two amazing grown children, two wonderful people married to those grown children, and one magnificently brilliant grandson, and one marvelously clever granddaughter. And I certainly understand why you feel that way about your grandchildren. Yes, ma'am. Yes, ma'am. So Tami, why don't you tell us why and when and how you got involved in prodigal ministry? I've always prayed for prodigals, but it was never a focus category. Does that make sense? I have always loved people who were not serving God, and I prayed for them.

2:56 But one day, somebody I loved dearly came to me and told me they no longer believed in God. And I knew there were problems already, and I'd been praying, but that set some things in order that set things rolling. It started a process of walking around my breakfast room table begging God to do what I wanted him to do. I'm usually telling him how to do what we want him to do. How to do his job, and then I would help him. And since Cripp's used to this person, argue with them and do that kind of thing. One day God just started pouring things into me, and I started sharing them, and that's where it started. And it has grown organically. It's just as it comes.

3:38 As it comes. Well, my first thought when anybody moves into prodigal ministry is you must have some deep spiritual roots because you are entering into fighting with Satan and the one who thinks he has those prodigals that they belong to him, that he's captured them. And so it's a fierce battlefield. And what do you think has prepared you to engage? Well, I have a very rich spiritual heritage. My dad's dad was a bishop and a pastor and evangelist. My mom's mom was a licensed minister, and my dad actually pastor for 49 years.

4:24 He just retired a couple of years ago when he was 81. And my mom, of course, minister, run along beside them. I watched them fight for prodigals they love, and we've seen those prodigals say. And so I not just that, but at an early age, the Lord helped me love his word and that's important. And I loved prayer early, almost prematurely for what some people would think. Does that make sense? I just I loved God and he just prepared me. That's all I know. And it wasn't on purpose. I wasn't saying, here we go. Let's do a prayer for prodigal ministry. Let's fight for prodigals. But God kept me close and he's helped me every step of the way.

5:07 So I love that verse, but it's greater is he that's in me than he that's in the world. Yes, I like that verse, too. Yes, very lovely. Well, you've been doing this for how many years now? I think about 11. I started a blog probably. No, it's been longer than that. I started a blog. Well, it has been 2012 was when I first started my first very rough, very, very rough. I'll just put it that way. And then it grew from there. So and then the books came and the ministry came and when we moved back to Huntsville 11 years ago, our church didn't have a prayer for prodigal's group. And I asked about that and someone asked the pastor, we'd only been there a few weeks and he said, yes, lead a prayer for prodigal's prayer time.

5:55 And that's how it started. That's how it started. I would write out prayer starters. I prayed with moms in touch. It used to be called moms in touch. No, I know that actually really well. And now they're moms in prayer, but you know, they subscribe to almost a formula for prayer. There's always a praise and there's always a special prayer. And there are other things that they do in that, but those three things really change the way I prayed, even at that early stage of this journey. And so I would write out prayer starters for a prayer time and it just went from there. That's how it all came to pink. And how did people find out about it?

6:36 Was it mostly then at first at your church and they called their friends? Yes, we actually had 30 something people show up at that first prayer meeting and it stayed like that for a long time. And we've some of the people that are praying with us still were at the very first meeting and they've seen so many miracles in their families lives. But one day somebody couldn't be there and they still wanted the prayer starter. So they said, would you send it to me in an email? So I did. And then a few weeks later, another person and so an email prayer starter list came to be and now I'm seeing them all over the world. Every week I send out a prayer starter and I share raindrops, praise reports that people send in and let me know about and allow me to share.

7:19 Anomously, of course, because we don't want to ever embarrass a prodigal. We don't ever want to create an atmosphere where they're subconscious to come back into our group, into loving court. And so that's and then the blog I created a new blog and because God just kept pouring things into me. He just allowed it to be a focus where I saw prodigal promises and almost every verse I read in the Bible. You know, you know how it is. It's just right in your face when God has called you to this. It's everywhere. And so I just started keeping a list and and so that's how all of this came about. Well, I am so glad, but I know that it's not just been the wonderful results of lives of prodigals, but God's worked in your life as a result of this ministry.

8:10 So what are some things that you've learned in this process? I think the thing I've learned that has affected me the most is I can really trust God. From that person who walked around around the breakfast room table begging God to do what I wanted him to do. That was really from a place of not trusting him. I didn't give him control. I didn't think that he was going to take care of it the right way. Frankly, I'm being honest. And I think we are all there at some point in our life. Yeah, and prodigal loving a prodigal will bring those kinds of things out in you. But I have learned that he does hear my prayers and not just mine.

8:54 He hears all of his children's prayers and he has answered some huge prayers for me. And so I think the main thing I've learned is I can trust him and when I find myself on my knees frantic again and begging him to do something and trying to tell him how to do his job. The Holy Spirit will say, Tami, you're telling me how to do my job again and I have to apologize and tell him I'm sorry. And then this piece will come over me, Miss Judy. And I will remember I trust God. I truly trust him. That's really I hope my listeners are hearing you say that. That is really an important thing to understand. We get to trust God.

9:36 We pray and we should. It's God someone who's going to do it. Right. So but I do have a question in this process. That can take a long time. Yes, ma'am. And and how does how do you maintain relationship when there's misunderstanding and disagreement and and they know you're trying you want them to change? How do you do that? I found that love is the key. I mean, you just have to love them unconditionally and, you know, you speak life to them.

10:20 You just receive them when they come around. You receive them because they're fearfully and wonderfully made. They're a gift from God to you. They've been put in your life for a reason and you instead of looking at what they've done. And what they're doing and the darkness that you see in their face. And you can see the marks on their body sometimes from the sins they've committed and the lifestyle they've chosen. And you look past that and to who they are to you. And you just love them. I never I don't condone sin. I do my best not to enable it ever.

11:00 Not knowingly ever. And so you just draw a line, but the line has to be drawn from love. And I've had a prodigal tell me one time. I can explain everything away about God, but I can't explain love. And I've had other moms tell me the same thing. Their children said, I just I'm reconsidering a relationship with God because of the way you've loved me, even in my even though I've caused you so much pain. And so I think that's the key. I do. That's that's one of my main messages. Yes, that not push away, but pull in close.

11:45 In fact, your book is titled when you love a prodigal. Yes. And so that's to me, that's what it's all about is loving them. Yes, you have to have some boundaries and and that's important. But sometimes those are hard boundaries. I mean, sometimes you literally have to make them leave your home. Yes. And sometimes you have to be very careful about even seeing them face to face, you know, because but God will help you make sure those boundaries are where they need to be and that they're done from a place of love and not from a place of anger. Always from a place of love. Always from a place of love.

12:25 So we're going to talk about the two books you've written. Okay. So far and the one that you're in finishing up. But I have a question. Okay. What prepared you to write these books? Well, that's, you know, I went to school for music. I taught music for 23 years and band for four piano for 23. I worshiped on stage. I led the choir was minister music, all that kind of stuff. And I never expected to lead a proper a protocol ministry or to write books. I just never. But when I look back on it now, I was published when I was 16 at a poem published at a worldwide magazine.

13:08 And I was thinking, well, that's kind of cool. You know, and then I never did it again. But the, the reason I mean, I did well in grammar. I had great teachers, you know, that explained all of that stuff to me. And it just clicked and I look back on it now and God really was preparing me to do this kind of thing. I, he's taught me to organize thoughts. He's given me, you know, everything I've needed to do this and even put people in my path to help me know how to publish. And, you know, everything just came together. I didn't have to seek it out. It was, it was just anointing and it was a calling. And my whole life I can look back over it and see that God brought me here through a process.

13:52 And so that's how all that came to be. And I love that he does that. You know, he's got his path for each of us, the good works that he's already prepared for us. Exactly. And sometimes he surprises you with a new kind of good work that he's prepared for you. For me doing a podcast was like, at that time I had never even listened to a podcast. And I said, why would you want me to do this? And the person from the podcast network said, because you have the message that we want to give. Yeah.

14:32 I said, Lord, and he said, yep. And every year when I'm supposed to kind of re-up, I say, am I supposed to keep doing this? And so far he said yes. And I got, okay, okay. And I talked to my son, our former prodigal, about it every time. And I say, are you still okay with this? And he always has the same answer. He says, I hope it helps a lot of people. So he's, for him, it's kind of his ministry now. And so, no, don't quit. So, all right, let's talk about your books. Each one we'll kind of look at.

15:14 The first one is Fighting for Your Protocol Through Prayer, 365 promises, praises, and prayers. Oh, I love that. And I know that the fighting part is real because it is a battle. We have an enemy and I love the promises from God, the praises that we can, and oh, how important it is that we can praise and the prayers and what we need to do continuously. So talk a little about that book. First, let me just say it's kind of a misnomer because there were actually 366 because I included February 29. And I just go, I thought about that about a year ago.

15:54 I was like, but it is too late anyway. You remember the email list and people asking me to send the email list and one day a woman who was receiving it said, Tami, you need to be saving these somewhere. And I had never considered that. So I started a list. And then one day somebody said, this really needs to be put into a book. And I was like, you know, that's probably not a bad idea. And so I started looking at what I had and found that they fit in 12 months. I'm a cry thinking about that because God just it organized itself. Basically, I mean, it was work. I mean, you have to. But it was crazy how they fell into place.

16:36 How they went, you know, every one of them fit into a theme. And then I could do a devotional for the beginning of the month. And then every promise, praise and prayer fit. And so, of course, you have to curate, make sure your promises match your praise and your praise matches your, your, your scripture. But that's how that book came to be. The I love about the promises. Build your faith because you can trust what God said. What he says he's going to do bottom line. And when you and I always put a praise in there that explained or shared or revealed his propensity to answer the prayer we're about to pray.

17:17 So the scripture prayer, you know, for asking him to, to manifest and stuff to them, you know, you can praise him for Jehovah's Shama, the Lord is there. He's already there with them, you know, and so it builds your faith to believe that what you're about to pray, God really will do. He really can do that. And so that's how that book came to be. Just it just, it was organic. It just kind of flowed from prayer starter for life for prayer group to somebody wants it on email to an email list to somebody saying, you know, you need to keep these. And then somebody saying you need to put a book and that's just how it happened. And so how has it have you gotten it out to people or how has God gotten it out to people?

18:00 I, you know, I actually, I have a note in my phone every Wednesday to market the books. I never market the books. This is probably the closest I've ever come to marketing the book. Well, I help. God just basically puts them, I have people come to me and say, how do I find your book? And it's on Amazon, of course. And so that puts it out there to people all over the world. But is a lot of us word of mouth. I, I don't really know what I'm doing except to follow what God tells me to do. And so far it's been the best thing that can happen, you know, and I lean not into my own understanding because there's not a whole lot of it.

18:41 Do you find yourself quoting from it or reading from it when on your prayer time or on your Facebook page? You know, I've prayed through the book probably. Well, I can't tell you how many is a prayer. I started, I started making tally marks at some point and I think I prayed through it three times. And about a year ago, the Lord said, stop praying through it and start doing the praises only. And I mean, not only there are days he says the prayers important today are the scripture. You need to pay attention to that scripture promise because you're going to need to hold on to that. But it became a whole thing of just praising him for who he is and realizing that the things we prayed are still before the throne.

19:23 And he still visits those prayers and they're still answerable. And so I do quote them. One of my favorite quotes is I'm walking in victory while praying through circumstances. What I see in front of me is not always wonderful, but I can always take it to the father and I'm walking in victory because he's promised to hear my prayers and answer them. So that's a victory. We're fighting from a place of victory. What we're doing. That's that's great. Your next book is called Encouragement in the Waiting for Your Protocol to Return to God. Now, probably what I hear almost more than anything is how long, Lord, when is this going to happen?

20:11 How long do I have to live through this? How long will this person I love keep on making these decisions? And and then you can apply it in life as well to everything else. How long, Lord, how long is fighting going on here and here and here? So whether it's fighting in our, our family or our friends or the whole world, how long, Lord? So what encouragement do you have as we wait? Well, the thing I first off, we're not waiting in a waiting room like we do in a doctor's office where you take out your phone and you fiddle and fiddle because you're just waiting. There's nothing restricted you can do.

20:53 In this waiting, we wait actively and we are waiting from a place of victory. We are waiting because God has given us amazing spiritual weapons to fight in this battle. We're not left in this battle alone. And that's incredible to remember. When you focus on God and who he is, we know that we're not waiting in the waiting room alone with nobody to talk to, no help, you know. And so I find that in the waiting, I made a list of them in my second book in a encouragement in the waiting. There's a whole chapter on the weapons and I'm so surprised. Not.

21:35 And when I was surprised when I started digging into the weapons God had given us, of course, they're the obvious ones, prayer, fasting and staying in the word. Those are obvious ones. I am going to find that chapter. Here we go. But what I didn't realize that truth is a weapon. Yes. Truth by definition never changes. So you never have to worry where it stands. You know, you can always stand on truth and that's a weapon. It's a purpose to stand. The names of God are a weapon. Because the more you know about God, the more you know what he will and will not do. And the more you can pray in his perfect will.

22:16 And then the less you're disappointed. Because sometimes I don't pray in God's will. I just don't. I'm human. And then I'm disappointed that God didn't do things my way yet again. And we have a theme. The names of God are a weapon. And then the name of Jesus. Absolutely. I always, and you do too. I don't know how many thousands and thousands of times I said in Jesus name, I pray. And when you do that, it's because the father pays attention because Jesus paid the price so they could be saved. Yeah. And it's a powerful thing. Of course, the word is a weapon. There's a weapon. Praise is a weapon. Faith is a weapon.

22:56 And it is not only an offensive weapon, but a defensive weapon because it in you, the shield of faith, which is every fiery dart of the evil one. And then it also is something that you project because you're hoping for things unseen. Anyway, let me go through a piece. Is a weapon. Because when you're frantic, you're not getting a whole lot done. At least I don't. Fasting, of course. And then the last one that really surprised me, righteousness is a weapon. And righteousness is a gift from God. It's something he gives us when we confess our sins. You know, we can nullify his righteousness a little bit when we sin. And we're not as effective in our prayers because he only says he hears only the righteous when we pray.

23:40 But the thing you've got is he gives us righteousness so that he can hear us. And I just think that that's an amazing thing. And when we come and confess that sin, then he restores. That's right. He sure does. He's faithful and just to forgive us. That's what the Bible says. So we're not just waiting in a waiting room with nothing to do. And we're not just waiting in a waiting room thinking that the outcome is going to be horrible. Because you never know sometimes when you go into a doctor's office what you're going to be told. But we have God's word. We have his promises. And we know that everything he promised, he will do. And so we're not waiting with no hope. We're waiting with amazing hope.

24:22 And I heard a definition one time about hope for a Christian. You know, when a non-Christian talks about hope, it's almost with they don't expect anything. I hope that would happen. It's almost like there's already a resignation that nothing good's going to happen. But when a Christian says, I hope, Jesus backs that hope. The word backs that hope. And it's a whole different ball game. It's like, it's a hope for things unseen. That's what faith is. It's the substance. Yes. And hope is what people need in this long journey. So that's what your book is about. It's why and how you can keep going with hope.

25:05 Because God is able and faithful and true to his word. So, yes. Yes. The, the encouragement in the book, I'll tell you where that came from. You know, I have a blog, I have two blogs. Actually, one is kind of dormant, but it's still available. God has just poured some beautiful things into me to help me in my journey. And sometimes he tells me, um, this is for you to share. And so it came to a point where I thought those things need to be out there. And so God, it was once again, it just kind of organized itself into chapters and, and, um, it just, and so I will tell you a story.

25:49 A few months after the book was published, I was talking to a friend about a really hard time I was going through and she told me, she said, Tami, I know somebody who wrote a book about encouragement. You know, you're right. And so a few days later, I guess I was telling my, my dad about it. And he said, well, Tami, I know somebody who wrote a book about encouragement. Maybe you should read it. So I did. And God encouraged me through even that situation. And I don't even know that anything to do with the prodigal. I can't remember what it was. I just remember thinking, thank you God, you know, for their gift of friends and family who reminds you, but also, you know, for the things that he, he's shown me through his word. It's just, it's an amazing thing and an honor to be used in that way.

26:32 You know how that is, Miss Judy. It's, it's, it is a remarkable thing and the lives that get changed. And you're right. We're talking about those with prodigals that they love, but it's, there are a lot of circumstances in our lives that are waiting times. And that is when God really grows our trust when he, before he shown up to take care of it even, he's, he helps us to trust him. And waiting is a huge part of that. Because if we didn't have to wait, we keep going kind of. And, but when we're waiting, it's like, Lord, and he, and my experience has been that often he's actually doing more work on me than what I'm praying about.

27:22 And that that's what the situation is, is you need to let go. You need to let me have this and trust me with it. So, yeah, waiting is a really wonderful thing, even though most of us hate it. The outcomes are usually with God, they're amazing because what's on the other side is always a victory. You asked me a while ago, I do like that Alabama term a while ago. You asked me a while ago what has changed in me and I talked about trust, but everything I've learned in this journey of loving prodigals and praying for them. Even praying with you guys on June the second, that's an incredible thing too for all of those names.

28:07 And what I've learned is that all of this doesn't just apply to prodigals. It has changed my life. It has changed my walk with God. It's changed how personable we are with each other. It's changed my being able to hear his voice more readily. It just changes so much about you as a person, not just as a leader of a ministry or somebody who prays for prodigals or a mom of a prodigal or a dad of a prodigal. It changes everything about your life. Yeah, that's one of the things that I try to convince my audience of the listeners here is that as much as this is about the prodigal one or ten or however many you are engaged with or love, it's about what God wants to do to make you more like Jesus.

28:54 He's all about conforming us to Christ. And if that were an easy thing, we wouldn't probably need to go through all this, but we don't mold very well. So, yeah. So let's talk about your upcoming book. This is intriguing to me. I get it, but it says, I love it. Trust God as his names and his attributes for your journey with the prodigal. How does that happen? What do you mean by that? Well, I've learned for myself that as I know more about God, and I said this earlier, the more I've learned to trust him, it's like when I met my husband, you know, I thought he was the most handsome thing ever.

29:47 You know how that is, Mr. Yoon. But if I had never spent time with him or learned anything about him, I would not trust him. I trust this man with my life. I trust him with my days. You know, I trust him to be in the same house with me and not feel threatened or anything. You know, we just trust him. The more we know about God because God is perfect. Kevin's close, as my pastor says about his wife. I hope he listens to this. I'm going to make it. But God really is perfect. And but anyway, so the more we know about God and I actually wrote a manuscript.

30:33 Probably, I would say in the mid-20th, like 2000, let's see 2009, something like that. I don't remember when it was and I tried to find it and I've got to find my manuscript. But it was called the names of God. But there have been so many books written about the names of God, really good books, powerful books, informative books. And my book wasn't ready yet because I didn't yet have this ministry and God prepared me for that. I got so much research done for that book. But it needed a focus and when life experience and life experience.

31:15 I was quite young and I didn't trust him like I do now. And just frankly, and I hope tomorrow I trust him even more than I do today and I believe that will happen. But anyway, I started looking at that book and I was thinking there are so many names and attributes and every time you call one of God, it makes me smile because there's something about it that's just wonderful. Every name, you know, but I got to realizing that every name of God that I knew. I reflected something, reflected his heart for prodigals and for those who love them. When I was a teenager, this is how I praised God. I would always open my prayer with God. I think you say you're perfect and good and holy and just and righteous and pure and kind.

31:59 And I had that memorized and that's what I use all the time because that's what I knew about God, that he was perfect and good and holy and just and righteous and pure and kind. You know, but I've learned so much since then about who he is. And I felt like God wanted me to share in this time if it's okay with you, Miss Judy, three particular names that have just really changed. They stick out to me and they comforted me. And so let me share. I think there are 39 names and attributes in the book which is are nowhere near how many there are. God is so complex and we will never know everything about the infinite God until hopefully when we see him face to face. Some of that will be, you know, even added. I can't imagine if I knew before him now and how much I love him.

32:42 I can't imagine how much for him going to love him there. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. First, El Shaddai is a name that means Almighty, All-Sufficient God. And I realized that that covers all the bases for this prodigal journey. He covers all the bases. He's almighty. He doesn't like any ability or power to do anything needed to save a prodigal. He has all of it and he's all sufficient. There's not a person that he doesn't have that he needs to use. There's not a situation he doesn't have that he can use. There's not an item he needs. They might need that would bring them to remembrance about who he is. He has everything needed to save a prodigal.

33:25 And I just, it's all encompassing and I love that. And I felt like that would be some, that one kind of just spoke to me personally about, well, it's about everything. He has everything about everything. About everything, yes. About everything. And then the second name, I didn't really know this name and I found it in some, I didn't even have it in the first book, the first manuscript, but Elohei Yishi, the God of my salvation. And when I started researching that book, I realized I'm not the God of salvation. That person who was praying for that prodigal walking around and around that breakfast dinner table was trying to be the God of salvation.

34:06 That person who was sending scripture text and arguing with them and doing all that was trying to be the God of salvation, trying to save that prodigal. I was trying to save that prodigal in my own abilities. But when I found out, which I knew this already, I did, you know, I didn't always live next. But when I realized, when I saw this name, it just hit me. I have parts to play in this journey. I do. I have to use those weapons that we talked about a while ago. I pray every day. I thank God every day for the things he's done. And there are many miracles. Well, I mean, if I'm real sick, I might not actually remember to thank God.

34:49 You know, saying that's the focus of mine. And I try to use these weapons every day, but I have to do my part in obedience to the Lord. And that was the problem with that person walking around that breakfast room table and doing all those things. I was doing them out of my own mental ability, my own intellect, my own knowledge without the Holy Spirit saying, use this nail, which meant that prodigal's heart was not prepared to receive that at that moment. And it only served to push that person away more and more. And so God is the God of salvation. And that's really say that again, that people, I want people to hear what you just said, that it's not your job.

35:30 It's his job. But the more you say that, the more you're actually pushing them away because he's not ready yet. They're right. The Holy Spirit is the only one who knows the work he's doing in an individual's heart. Bottom line. And I believe that's one of the reasons we're not supposed to judge each other because we really have no clue. Even people who die, we preach them into heaven or hell, you know, but we don't really know their heart. Only the Holy Spirit knows a heart and it's not our job to know a heart. But he knows when they're ready. He knows when, if you told them today, God is real and he loves you and they might cast you out to your face.

36:10 But if the heart is prepared and you tell them God loves you and he's real, then they can receive that and it can make a change. And so I just try really hard not to do anything of my own will. In fact, one day I was doing the circuit around the breakfast room table and begging and crying and probably screaming at God and not mad, just demanding and well, and hurt probably. But he spoke to me. He said, Tami, withdraw your hand and let me be God in his life. And I, it just stopped me cold and I said, okay, God, I'll do my best.

36:52 I'll, you know, I'll try to relinquish control. It may be a process and you'll have to help me every moment of every day. But then I went to the church that I think it was the next Sunday and I felt like God told me to have my pastor pray for me. His name is James Vaughan, which I think is really cool. But I'm past the time. But he came and prayed for me and the Holy Spirit spoke to him and said, withdraw your hand and let me be God in his life. Almost word for word what God had spoken to me around that breakfast room table and I realized I had no choice. If I wanted that protocol to be saved, I had no choice because I was hindering. I was in the way.

37:32 And so anyway, God of salvation. And there's one more, and this is for the parents and those who love a prodigal who have been canceled or isolated from their prodigal because the prodigal doesn't want you to see the sin in their lives or because you don't even know where they are. Addictions have taken them to a place you have no clue where they are. I even had a mom run you one time. She said, I'm not, I don't know where my prodigal is and I haven't for 10 years, but I have heard that he's alive. I'm sorry, that broke my heart. But, but this this name right here is for that person who loves that kind of a prodigal. You've been canceled. The pain is so intense when I can't imagine being separated like that from my child or from somebody else.

38:17 I love not knowing where they are, what condition they're in. But God is Jehovah's shaman. The Lord is there. And even if you can't be there, you can trust him to never leave them or forsake them. He will always be there and Psalm 139 tickles me good. It just makes me giggle and I smile big because, you know, I take it as a as a song for us. Everybody is a song for everybody, but it tickles me because of prodigals. This is I'll just read a few verses. Where can I go from your spirit? Now, imagine they're trying to get away from the spirit of God because they don't want to be condemned. They don't want condemnation. You know, or where can I flee from your presence?

38:58 If I send into heaven, you're there. If I make my bed and help, they hold you were there. If I take the wings of the morning and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea, even there your hands shall leave me. And then it says, and your right hand shall hold me. If I say, surely the darkness shall follow me. Even the night shall be light about me. Indeed, the darkness shall not hide from you. But the night shines as the day, the darkness and the light or both alike to you. And that just tickles me. It is such a good promise because the Lord has promised to never leave them alone and not just lead them by themselves, but to leave them alone and not pursue them. He's aggraved them pursuing them.

39:38 He's working on them. But Jehovah's shaman is a very good thing to hold on to. Tami, I hope my listeners are just saying, yes, I can do that. I'm going to try that because God is giving you lots of insight and understanding of Scripture and life experience to see how it works in real life day to day. And so I think that the wisdom and the admonitions that you've given us that God gave you are going to be a great help to our listeners. And I think that's just great.

40:18 So one last thought, question. Yes. So what that you haven't said or just to amplify in what you have said has been most important in your life that you've learned through this. I just think one day I was praying, I'll just put it this way. And well, actually I was reading the Bible and it was Psalm, I think it was 150 years at 100. It says, praise him in his mighty firmament. That's a King James word. That's Bible I grew up on. It's what I've memorized. And I mean, anyway, so I've always been intrigued by that word. So I realized that there was a little thing in the center column of my Bible and it's a reference and it said, expand.

41:05 And being from Huntsville, or not from here, but I've lived here from us in my life, being from Huntsville, the Space Center is very important. NASA's here, you know. And there's the Hubble telescope and I was praying about this and God showed me, he said, Tami, my creation reveals who I am. And I realized that the Hubble telescope showed us things we had no clue were out there. And then they built a bigger telescope and I can't remember the name of that one. And it showed us there's even more. Even more. And what I know about God is he is infinite. And the more I see more telescope, the more powerful telescopes I build to look into what he is and who he is and what he will and will not do, the more wonderfulness I find and the more I find that I can trust him.

41:52 And that is that I guess that's I praise him in his mighty expense because all of he who he is, all of who he is is in the mighty expand. There's not a piece. It's not like a puzzle. Love here and a piece of peace here and a piece of Jehovah's shaman there and a piece of El Shaddai over here. All of him is in all of him. He's a huge big, almighty, all sufficient God and we can trust him. That's what I've looked. I feel him here in this room. I love him so much. And I think he's definitely in our conversation. And I think that God's going to just touch hearts because you've given such good insights and wisdom.

42:38 So I would like to ask you before I close out to pray for them. The listeners father, our father, first, let me praise you because you are you are El Shaddai, Almighty, all sufficient God. You are Jehovah's shaman, the Lord who is there with them and here with us and you are God of salvation. You're the God we can trust with them. You're the God who gives us peace. You're the God who takes the yoke with us. God, you're the God who never leaves us in this journey. You're here with us and I just give you praise. I thank you God for our protocols. I thank you for who they are to us and I thank you for the good you're bringing through their difficult journey.

43:22 Not only in our life, but I don't believe you're going to waste anything in their life either. Lord, and so I'm grateful for who they are and I grateful that you've kept them, that you've done miracles in their lives, that you've protected them, that you're drawing them. But Lord, let me pray for those who love a prodigal and have been in this journey, some not for very long, the news is still fresh and your heart is broken. Their heart is broken. God, so let me just pray for that person that you will give them a promise on which they can stand so that when days are really hard and what they see in front of them is not okay. That they can stand on that same. What I see is not real, but what God has promised, that's what's real.

44:06 God, and I pray that they'll have, that you'll help them more heal their hearts, heal their hurts, help them to do every decision. Some of the hard ones, God, even from a place of love, give them that wisdom, God, that only comes from you. Holy Spirit, you're the only one who knows that heart. So we're asking you to bless those parents, those grandparents, the spouses, the siblings, the friends. God, whoever loves a prodigal enough to receive the burden and pray for them, God bless them. And God, for the parents that have been canceled, this horrible cultural thing going on more about canceling your parents, that they don't support your sin. God, I pray for those parents too, that you'll heal their hearts and that you'll give them strength to go on when the days are very hard.

44:48 Remind them of who you are and that you're working even when they have no clue where their prodigals are. God, just give them that peace every day that you've not forgotten, that you're aware of their prodigal every moment and you're aware of them. Give them, as my friend Darly says, make them aware of your awareness. And Lord, I pray not only all of these things, God, but you've given all of us a ministry, a calling, a purpose. And so I'm asking you Lord, even in this difficult time, that you will anoint them with fresh oil every day, not only to serve their prodigals and to stand and fight for them, God, using the mighty weapons you've given them.

45:29 God, but I pray that you'll also anoint them with fresh oil every day for their personal ministry. Help their ministry to still be effective, God, and help it to be even more effective because of what they're learning about you, about your word, about what you will or will not do, about how much you love them and their prodigals. God, I ask you just to bless them more. And God, may we all see every prodigal saved soon. God, I have parents ask me to pray for suddenlies. God, but I know that what seems like a sudden to us is something you've been working on from the beginning because you've had a plan from the beginning on how to save prodigals. Your word tells us that you're not willing that any should perish.

46:09 And so let me just ask you Lord, if you would save them, sanctify them, fill them with your spirit and anoint them for their ministry and calling, fulfill your purpose and calling in their lives. And God, I pray that while they're in this prodigal journey that they will not do anything that will hinder their future ministry. God, they will not one decision will do anything against what you call them to do, but instead that you'll be able to use all of it to help them to do and to fight in your kingdom and be a blessing in your kingdom more. God, we ask these things in the mighty name of Jesus. Amen. Amen. Thank you, dear. Thank you.

46:49 So to my listeners, what has captured your mind and your heart that you can apply in your journey that you can claim practice as you keep on praying? I just really encourage you to grab one thing at least that you can apply in the days ahead. And I'm offering to give you, I may give away two of each of her books that are out. And if you'd like to be in the drawing for them, check in on the show notes. You can get those at my website, JudyDouglas.com or on Apple.

47:32 They have show notes. Some of the other places don't. So that's where you can sign up to be in the drawing. So God bless you and may what is often a very hard time at Christmas for those who love a prodigal, that you would give each of us, each of those listening your peace and just a sense that just as you love us, you love our prodigals and you're always, always working. Thank you Lord.